Have any kayakers out there ever experienced severe pain in the outer lower leg when in the sitting position i.e. knee behind pad and foot on foot rest? Would appreciate any advice. brendan

WELCOME TO PLAYBOATING!!! it canbe down to your to your boat set-up but all of us suffer from this at somepoint and over time you will get used to it.

Try squirtboating lol

I'm referring to an injury of some description. It's just the one leg and since I first discovered it a couple of months ago, I have it constantly when my leg is in that position. I'm wondering if there is a particular strain or injury in this part of the body that can be brought on by paddling.

Best bet is to get it checked out if you think there is a problem, if you also run and cycle alot then it could be an ITC injury, if I get this right there is a ligament that runs from you hip to the end of your foot and can be irratated in sitting positions, stick your thumb on the outside of your knee about 5 inches up and push, if you cry in pain that you have hit the right spot. Get physio and learn the right stretches. having nearly broken every bone in my body I can not recomend enough getting the right treatment streight away even if you have to pay for it.

What SlapHappy is talking about is called IT Band Friction Syndrome and there is no tendon from you hip to you foot. It originates on the Iliac Crest of the hip bone and inserts on Gerdy’s tubercle (outside of the tibial head).
There is not enough information here to make an educated guess!

Where is your pain?
Describe the pain.
What makes it better?
What makes it worse?
When do you experience the pain most often?
When do you not experience the pain?
Have you injured your back or hip or knee or ankle before?
On a scale of 1-10, 10 being the worst pain possible how would you rate your pain?
Have you had this pain before?
How long have you had this pain for?
Any back pain or soreness also?
Can you reproduce the pain outside of the boat?
Any family history of arthritis, diabetese, backproblems, cancer, or any other disease?

These are all important questions each of them leading to important clinical impressions. The body is incredibly complex. I would strongly discourage you from asking for advice on pain related issues in such a forum. I've seen some serious BS come from people who have realy no idea what they are talking about. Everyone wants to be an expert and share their two cents.

Many people are quick to give responses without having a clue of differential diagnosese, assesment, orthopedic evaluation, acute illness and injury, and general medicine. Then one must also have a foundation in rehabilitation, therapeudic modalities, etc... in order to help manage or treat these injuries. People are also naive enough that if you describe a pain which is similar to a pain that they have had, that you should try what they tried to get rid of the pain. This is a basic train of thought as they are projecting themselves onto you and also are unaware of the danger of untreated or mismanaged injuries.

The worst thing people can do is read a book or a magazine and think they know what's going on.

Seek professional advice.

Good luck,
Whitewaterules

I appreciate what you are saying. These things are rarely simple and usually interrelated with another part of the anatomy. However, I've been to 'medics' with injuries before and been disappointed with the results. The reason I posted is, I'm wondering if this injury is common among kayakers. It may have resulted from another activity, I do cycle and run, but it happens to be most painful in the kayak sitting position - which I can recreate sitting here at my desk - ouch! Instant relief when I change the position of my leg. It could be old age but I'll never admit to that.
I am old, I am old, but still my kayak rolled.

There is not enough information here to make an educated guess!

Or in my case an uneducated one but had the same problem and it only effected when sitting. Luckily WWR really knows his anatomy, and all those long words that go with it

Totally agree get advise the NHS here are crap (my opinion only before I get flamed.) the only reason I can get out of bed in the morning is because I paid for treatment after they insisted I was imagining 5 broken bones in my foot...

Sports injury relatd physios I think are worth their weight in gold but you have to pay top money and get a good one.

I studied Athletic Trainning in college (University Of New England, USA) and have numerous hours of clinical experience with thrapy, rehab, acute illness and injury, gross anatomy, and general medicine.

Your sypmtoms typically happen for one of three reasons. This is either a circulatory issue or a neurological one or both well it could also be Piriformis syndrome (don't worry sounds worse than it is I'll explain this one last.)

Well let me start by saying, you should talk to a doctor always when any part of your body goes numb or has severe pain. Why? Sound like overkill? You can cause long-term irreversible damage to nerves if they are pinched (impinged) or if circulation is compromised to nerves or other tissues over time. These injuries to nerves happen over time and may result in long-term damage. Nerves don't heal, they die and some nerve cells are able to regrow. You may not feel the change as it may happen slowly over time, such as a person loosing hearing. The result may be decreased sensation. Anyhow... enough about disclaimer, but please take this seriously.

Impression (from least to most likely)

#1 Circulatory issue:
You arterial supply for the femur and therefore lower leg is the Femoral artery, which passes down the front of your leg near your crotch. This is unlikely the culprit because this artery is deep and cannot really be pinched off especially in a sitting position.

Managment: If it is a circulatory issue it is most likely happening at the ankle or foot itself. So... pad your foot area or feet to reduce pressure points and/or unnatural foot positioning.

# 2 Impingement (pinched nerve):
Symptoms that may constitute a medical emergency include progressive weakness in the leg or bladder/bowel incontinence. These symptoms may result from cauda equina syndrome and should seek immediate medical attention. In general, patients with complicating factors should contact their doctor if sciatica occurs, including people who have been diagnosed with cancer; take steroid medication; abuse drugs; have unexplained, significant weight low (possible cancer); or have HIV.

Now, that being said... the above is not likely but nerve involvement always warrant medical follow up.

Numbness, tingeling, burning, sharp pain could mean that a nerve is being compromised somehow, either blood supply or physical pressure on a nerve. I don't believe it is compromised due to poor circulation. This could come from anywhere along the nerve route starting from your Lumbar Vertebrae (lower back/spine) to the foot itself. With injured discs or spinal stenosis (narrowing of the spinal canal), low back pain may be present along with the leg pain, but usually the low back pain is less severe than the leg pain. Other SYMPTOMS INCLUDE; pain in the rear or leg that is worse when sitting, burning or tingling down the leg, weakness, numbness or difficulty moving the leg or foot, a constant pain on one side of the rear, a shooting pain that makes it difficult to stand up. Not all of these symptoms have to be present at once for this to give you the impression of vertebral involvement.

Management: Please consult a physician first. Typically, the numbness is dependant on position of the spine not as much the leg or foot. In this is the case, tightening a back band could be making it better or worse. Generally, slouching makes the symptoms worse, so sit up straight and work on stretching your hamstrings for better posture.

# 3 Piriformis Syndrome/Sciatic nerve involvement:
Piriformis syndrome is when the Piriformis muscle (deep in your butt cheek/hip area) becomes tight or spasms and places pressure on the sciatic nerve that runs beneath it. With some people this nerve actually runs through the Piriformis muscle placing even greater pressure on the nerve. Pressure on the sciatic nerve can cause low back pain and/or pain that radiates to the rear and down the leg (similar to sciatica pain). Piriformis Syndrome does not cause true sciatica but it can cause nerve damage as well. Like sciatica, Piriformis syndrome can cause pain, numbness and tingling along the sciatic nerve, which runs down the back of the leg and into the foot.

Management: The key for Piriformis Syndrome is well it's all about leg/hip positioning. Try loosening the backband, try more padding in the seat, or less padding. Take pressure off your butt cheek any way you can and sit on the two bones under your butt not on the glutes (butt muscles). Also, having more or a bend in your knees may help. Finally taking your legs from a less cross-legged hip position to a more parallel and straight position is likely to help.

So my point is you should not take this lightly if it is persistent pain and the pain is severe. Consult a physician before following any of my suggestions.

Let me know how it goes,
Whitewaterules

be sure to show medical personel the exact position you are sitting in when kayaking because it could shed some light on things for them. That was my experience.
I had a knee problem on the left leg, outside of the knee that radiated down about half of my lower leg on the outside. It ended up being a ligament (forget the name of which one) because my knees were spread so far apart ever since playboats have reached a 25\" width.
It took rest, then developing a habit of stretching (using some poses I learned through easy Yoga), and I tend to squash my knees against the inside of the thigh hooks, and pad the outside so I can keep that position. The 1/2\" adjustment helps.

I was lucky, but without the aid of a doctor I would have never figured it out.